Saturday, March 6, 2010
Darkside, here I come!!!
------ Car tire update ------------
So what's next?
Two brands I believe in, Mobil 1 and Michelin... Meet the Energy Saver 195/60-16. I'll do it in a few weeks, I want to get the last of the Bridgestone...
And it is too big! Rubs the drive shaft... back to Michelin Commander stock size, over and out!!! I'm done with a failed experiment....
------------------ Car tire update 07/27/11 ------------------
After 20K, sigh.... I picked the worst tire I could find... worn out, it has some semblance of tread, but not much more than what would grab your fingernail.....
BUT!!!! There is always one... Look at that contact patch!!! The handle bars are straight ahead, not to the left, but I got contact!!!!
Next is a Michelin ENERGY SAVER - 195/60-16 I believe in two brands, Michelin and Mobil 1 oil.... Lets see what this one does!!!
Called my wrench and asked about changing the tire, he said no problem, I'll just take it to a tire shop! They can't balance it, and I said "that's what dynabeads are for"..... the journey continues.....
------------------ update 08/09 -------------------
What me change???!!! Tire 28 psi shock rebound 3 shock unchanged between 15 and 20... I want the lower pressure so the tire will sit flatter. As I was letting out 4 psi, the tire really settled down. The 2 to 3 on the shock was to stop the softness from causing a bounce in rough curves... so far so good..... X fingers crossed!
---------- update 08/02/10 ------------------------
Posted on VROC:
I've finally got 'er settled and like what I have!
Sweet spot is 32 psi, 2 on rebound and close to 20 psi in the rear shocks.
The tire is very smooth on the road and works fine in the twisty's! NO resistance to turning and handles fine. I do not push a scoot, just go down the road, so consider my casual riding.
Checked the tire for wear it has 4 tread grooves:
Groves L-R 9170 miles 3/16, 5/32, 5/32, 3/16 I didn't check it new but think 3/16 was the max.
If you look at my blog about going to the darkside (below), the profile shows that it has a natural curvature, but this was while the tire was at 40 psi for break in. And I don't think it is much different at 32.
And I've ridden all year and do not have to worry about tires! I like that! 'course, stuff happens.....
---------- end update ------------------
Pics are from top to bottom, click on a pic for a larger pic, text for a pic is under the pic.
WWWWWWWHHHHHHHHHHHOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!! On to the Darkside!!! And adventure about to unfold before your unbelieving eyes!!!!!!!!! Are you ready??!!!!! GBG!
MANY folks put car tires (CT) on the back of their scoot for miles and comfort. Some folks run V2K scoots that eat back tires in 6K miles... It is not only a cost, but huge inconvenience if you travel and have to plan a tire change along the way.
CTs will get over 40K, They cost less, making you less "tired" and well, the thought of heading into the Darkside.... here I come! GBG
Here is a link to their site: http://darkside.nwff.info/index.php
It has a tire calculator to tell you the effect of what is stock -vs- what you plan to put on your scoot. It also has a database of what everyone else is running.
My stock was 150/80-16 and I put on a 195/60-16. It says if I'm going 65, I'll now be going 64.4. Now if you understand my speedo is 10% in error, this is a joke, if it indicates 60, I'm going 54, now 53.5 or thereabouts, and a big whoop... GBG
The tire is a Bridgestone Turanza EL 400 - 2 summer tire, didn't see a need for an all weather!! GBG
BTW, in getting a CT, be sure to get one that is SUMMER rated. Methinks you do not need a M+S or all season. I say that for the softer simpler less mass tire.
There are many thoughts about doing this, do not enter lightly, but some of our riders could use a 40K tire on their scoots! Your choice, I'm just here to tell you to DO IT!!!! GBG
So everyone says the CT is wide, not round, the profile is ALL wrong, It won't work, it won't fit, you're crazy... now I fit that one! Well let's see...
Well, when I got Ruby II at about 10K, they guy said it was a new rear tire, the second one.... 10K... does not compute to me, BUT, I looked at it as thought, this is a joke, but so what? He apparently rode freeways 2-up with insufficient tire pressure. BTW, I'm at a little over 15K!
Well, it surprised me how fast it went... note the tread wear test may not work here....
Darkside, here we go!! I GOT TREAD!!!! Now to get it mounted..... drama begins...
So I go to my only wrench, and he is fantastic! NONE better and can do anything and is now a Darkside tire mount source!!
2744 Aiello Dr, Unit 110
San Jose, CA 95111
So I walk in with my CT and his helper/secty says - prepare yourself... that's a car tire! Now I've been known to handle the obvious in a somewhat blunt manner, and I said yes it is! GBG
Well he started with... get outta here.... But... but... I know what I'm doing and it will fit! MANY folks do this! This is a GOOD THING!!! Then in my bashfulness, I say just put it on!
So he points to Rob, my friend and can and will do anything on a scoot... Rob walks over and looks at the tire and said.. you're crazy! Here we go again... I explain.. it works, it is the right size... just put it on.... He is an easy going person, just pay him.
The saga begins.. He takes the back tire down to our local and good bike shop, Road Rider on Monterey, and they are known far and wide.... ring...ring.... we will not install a car tire on your rim!!
Do you want me to sign a release? No, we won't do it... Can I talk to Rob? I'll translate, ask him if he knows someone that will put the tire on and spin balance it... They talked about a local car tire shop..... did not hear any more 'til later.
Got 'er mounted... get your mind out of the .... and look at that contact patch! I GOT CONTACT! And that is on the kickstand. That is at 40 psi! I'm thinking 35.... I have to clarify for truth, the handlebars were turned to the right, not worse case....
From what I've read, psi is important to the individual and machine. Higher psi for firmness, lower psi for weight load. At about 600 lbs of load, 28 would not be out of order, but then, maybe a bit too squishy. Time, after break in will tell...
When I went to pick it up... I asked Rob if he tested it... he said no... I said.. well do you know a better time to try it and see what its like? He got his helmet and off he went.. he made a trip around the block and he came back, looking and riding fine... shaking his head!
.. what did you think? Still shaking head... says it works! Feels a bit on the wants to stay up, but works! His entire shop has this puzzled expression and look at that tire, it's hurting their minds.
I explain, the scoot weights around 800, me loaded down 200,, 1000 x 60% rear load, the tire only has 600 lbs on it! I have to break it in at 40 psi for 500 miles to settle it in, but after that I can trade off on weight and firmness. And I may leave it at 40! Felt great!
So off I go for my "voyage" and I'm concerned it won't want to lean... WAKE UP!!! That damn thing bends right over! NO problem! I run it down the road, weaving around to get the feel, get to S San Jose, get on 101 and run 'er up to 90, I'm sure that's a tad under 81, sigh, and all is fine!
I'm being extremely picky here, but I "might" sense a slight bit of transition going around a corner when the tire reaches a lean point and then really wants to lean. Leaning is NOT a concern! I think my learning curve will be fast, and in honesty, if I could forget it's back there, not a problem!
Come back up Monterey, the worst of the worst roads around, and it's better than my old shoes!
Now look at that TREAD! I put pic 1 below so you can scroll up and down and compare. Notice the tire is a bit rounded, not flat. That's because the rim is narrower than a car rim and it helps it turn as it's pulling it inward.
Looks pretty similar to me! There is very little change in profile, I know - a new scoot tire would not look the same - point, the transition was almost 0!
Now I said he was a freeway runner... click on the pic and look at the side tread... that tire was ridden straight up!!! Nice side tread! Now notice the HUGE difference in the tire profile! NOT!! GBG
After Rob rode it, he said, I was concerned it would not fit.. and it fit perfectly!!! He was amazed! I opened up a LOT of minds! No, it's not for a wee wee machine but for the cruisers that a lot of us ride... you would be amazed! JM2C
There is one concern, if on the highway and you have a problem, how do you fix it? Well a plug works for most, but the problem is if you need a shop to work on it, an auto shop is out of the ?, and if like I discovered, some bike shops give you gas, guess worst case, you tell 'um to take the CT off and put on a scoot tire, or look for someone that will fix it.. THAT is a wrinkle, I thought about it after I made this choice, guess I'll know more down the road... GBG
Now I think there is some lettuce growing some where and a 2K ride is in order!